Archived and Historical Thread:
GLADES COUNTRY CLUB, CONDOS FOR SALE IN NAPLES FLORIDA,
Association has decided to reconstruct the Gof course for the third time at a cost of $ 3800.00 per condominium, payable by the owners.
(1169 units )
Living the condo life is a risky, unpredictable lifestyle and you are always only...
ONE election away
ONE board member away from tyranny
ONE management company away from embezzlement
ONE Condo lawyer away from the litigious vortex of condo life
ONE insurance broker away from fraud
ONE maintenance vendor away from kickbacks
This page is comparing a Florida Condominium Association to a Home Owners Association. Including recent sales transactions, this page contains valuable information that is usually not available. It compares 1 large golf course condominium and a 1 large golf course home owner association which is updated with the latest, whenever new data is received. This page should be read by anybody intending to buying into a Florida condominium or home owners association and participate within.
What happens if you do not participate in a condominium association:
"One of the
penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that you end up being
governed by your inferiors."
175, Harrison, 1985 to 2001
Ihis page also contains the most important links to government and other agencies for condominium owners looking for help and advice. Find them at the bottom of the page.
Are they really the best deals in South West Florida ?
Golf course condominiums for sale and seasonal rentals
In the Glades Golf and Country Club
(1169 units )
see their site at http://www.gladescountryclub.com
See the Maps and Directions on GOOGLE EARTH
Link to Naples Weather Today ► http://wwwa.accuweather.com/index-forecast.asp?partner=apple&myadc=0&zipcode=34112&u=1
The Glades owners voted no to the purchase of a piece of their golf course situated behind the Town Center complex which was forgotten to buy in 1981 when they bought the golf course from the developer. The developer who now still owns the piece of land had threatened to build affordable apartments of the land.
At this time the number has reached over 100 and prices are falling by $ 50,000 from last years average.
It has been reported that there are over 80 Condos for sale at the Glades.
There where 3225 foreclosures in Collier County until December 28, 2007, an increase of 400% over 2006
At today's date of October 27 a total of still 6 units sold since January 1. This could present some real difficulties for the condo association if many of the units for sale can not pay for the monthly maintenance charges which belong to the highest in Florida.
In spring there were 85 units for sale. The Naples News reported a total of six sales for the whole years so far. We assume there sgould be over a 100 on the market by now as many people can not afford the high maintenance feew anymore. The prediction is that prices will soon start to come down as younger people inheriting Glades units will unload them at any price.
August 19. 2007
Finally last week a couple of condos in the Glades was listed as sold. Now in August they should get the insurance renewal which for sure will not have been in the budget.
Still no condos sold over the last 2 month. There must be at least 85 for sale. At an average of close ro $ 500.00 maintenance fees per month, it is no more bargain for the older people who play no more golf or have medical problems.
May 29. 2007
Nearly 10% of the Condos at the Glades are now for sale and no new sales have been announced. This could mean that prices that just about doubled over the last 3 years will drop considerably. Still no sales listed in today's Naples News.
March 22, 2007
There has been only 2 condos listed in 2007 as being sold up to now. The Glades is bustling with for sale signs and open houses. Prices must be coming down by now. One interesting point is that the prices in Winterpark are now averaging $ 250,000 which is 20% more thanthe average in the Glades. Winterpark condos have no balconies and nor much green space like the Glades.
January 1, 2007
Over one million dollars has been spent by the Glades for roof repair and new roofs after the hurricane of 2005. The contract was not sent out for competitive bids but was handed to one contractor without the required bids.
November 11, 2006
There now around 80 condos for sale in the Glades Country Clubm an amount that has never been seen in its existence. Somehow the prices have not come down and owners are still trying to get the high prices.
September 1, 2006
The President transmits to the owners that a compromise has been reached on the contested boundaries between the holes 5 &6 on the Palmetto course, There will be no changes to the golf course, therefore ine can assume that the Glades was forced to purchase of the contested property at an unspecified amount, This should result into another special assessment.
The board now wants to renovate again the money loosing 19th Hole Restaurant that has gone from a yearly loss of $ 50,000 12 years ago to close to $ 400,000 a year. (the higher the sales, the higher the loss)The board wants to move the bar to a back room to have more space for bingo games. Cost a few hundred thousand.
The board of Director has decided to borrow 1 million Dollars and pay it back with a special assessment of $ 855.43 per unit.
Which seems to justify above rumoured figures.
Is the Glades Country Club still the best deal as they claim ?.............Condo sales prices are now adjusting to other golfing areas in Naples, while maintenance cost and expenditures are continuously going up. The Glades Association still has no flood insurance and could not afford it without raising maintenance fees another $ 100.00 per month. If a hurricane would flood the area the buildings in the Glades would not be covered. The associations maintenance fees are now definitely the highest in all of Florida.
Read on discrimination for renters in the Glades Country Club further down
Or own a house at the same price as a condo in the Glades will cost you, (500 villas and 200 manufactured homes on beautiful landscaped wide spaced lots and wide roads with side walks) on the Riviera Golf Course were real estate prices have been steadily rising, but is still the best deal in the Naples area with the best managed home owners association in the Naples area.
RIVIERA GOLF ESTATES
and own your own lot, and can have your own orange and grapefruit trees in the front or backyard
Map of Riviera Golf Estates
Naples, FL 34112-7126
Click to go to: Riviera Golf Estates
GLADES CC APARTMENTS ASSOCIATION
All the golf you can play, since January 2003, is now included in the monthly maintenance fees, The board is preparing to introduce golfing fees again on top of the very high maintenance fees
also the most expensive monthly maintenance fees ($442.00 + increases to about $ 500.00 per month for 2007 + special assessments) for NON-GOLFERS in ALL of South West Florida
The Glades Country Club from a birds eye view
Link to see sales transactions and prices they are selling for, in the Glades Country Club from 2003 to the latest in 2005
and their selling values updated weekly
Click ► Glades Country Club sales 2003 - 2005
GOVERNOR JEB BUSH APPOINTS FLORIDA CONDO OMBUDSMAN
click for details ►GOVERNOR JEB BUSH APPOINTS CONDO OMBUDSMAN
It has all changed, today the condos can be had for a song, as one wnet for $ 36,000 in May 2012
Average selling price in 2005-2006
View from Balcony
Beautiful location in the GLADES GOLF AND COUNTRY CLUB overlooking lake at the 11th hole.
Located in east Naples behind Collier County Government Buildings
2 golf courses, 16 tennis courts, 10 swimming pools and over 4000 palm trees
Walking distance to Clubhouse, restaurant, pro-shop, T-off and main swimming pool.
Shopping at 2 minutes by car
Year round Golf included in monthly maintenance fees
( 2005, WARNING = do to monetary problems and overspending by the association, the, board of directors is planning to re-introduce extra charges for playing golf during this year, maintenance fees will not be reduced )
2nd floor in 2 floor, 4 apartment building
address: 175 Harrison Rd. # 4, Naples Florida
View from parking and entrance area
unfurnished, built in 1971
2 Bedrooms / 2 full bathrooms
1250 sq. feet under air
plus 240 sq. foot balcony overlooking golf course, covered and enclosed, Mexican Tile floor
Kitchen, Bathrooms and Living room newly tiled with 18 inch tiles in diamond shape
Facing golf course, upstairs at 175 Harrison Road
upper unit had an asking Price in 2003 of $ 102,000.00
lower unit on picture sold for $ 198,000 in Spring 2005
in 2012 the situation has totally changed
S O L D for $ 94,000 un-furnished, (Jan2002)
today in 2005 they can go for $ 198,000 (as just did the lower unit in picture in May 2005)
similar ones available on the listed market plus some unlisted ones.
Link for some current listings in Naples at► http://naplesarea.com below
Click for currant listings in the Glades ► http://18.104.22.168/templates/home_results.cfm
Average Expenses per condominium: for the year 2013
Monthly maintenance including Tennis, Golf on both courses, for 2 persons: $ 600.00
Taxes: in 2005, $ 850.00 / year,
Insurance: $ 420.00 year, Flood insurance $ 499.00 (Association has no, can not afford flood insurance, owners will have to cover any damages to buildings by assessment)
Due Hurricane activity in the summer of 2005 substantial increases will be in force in 2006.
TV: full channel selection included in maintenance fees
Parking: outside, included for 2 cars per condominium
Garbage collection: included in maintenance fees, (3x weekly, Monday, Wednesday, Friday)
Water and sewer: included in maintenance fee
Landscaping and mowing: included in maintenance fees
Electricity: average $ 80.00 per month for air and or heat,
Waterworks Assessment click for details :
Click►►Glades special Assessment
Hurricane Wilma and its problems for the Glades
(October 24. 2005, 5am) Hurricane Wilma starting to batter Naples with 230km wind at day break today in company with a storm surge of up to 16 feet if conditions are right (it will be high tide at daybreak). Sadly a number of Glades residents have chosen to ride out the storm in their condos despite warnings. We hope they will make it through today and tomorrow
(October 22, 2005) Management of the Club has closed offices and abandoned operations yesterday Friday, leaving nobody to be contacted in case of emergency, which the threatening Hurricane Wilma will undoubtedly provide. Owners should also be advised that the Glades is heavily under insured for the coming disaster, specially there is no flood insurance.
Old Water works renoavtion
The renovation cost for the old water works the Glades purchased for close to $ 300,000 has reached a cost of $ 166,000. By the time it will be all done it will be half a million dollars.
June 26. 2005
The Clubhouse complex at the main swimming pool shall be replaced with a newer more modern bersion at the cost of $ 5,000,000, has to be better than the new Foxfire clubhouse that got built for $ 3,500,000
There is a trend to charge again for golf without reducing maintenance fees. If this becomes an actuality the Glades will be the most expensive condo association in Naples.
The 19th Hole, the Glades restaurant has a new record in negative profitability. In a period of 10 years it has managed to increase its yearly loss from about $ 50,000 to close to $ 400,000 in 2005. The more business the restaurant is doing the more it cost's the Glades members in maintenance fees.
May 14, 2005
The Board of directors is using the absence of the snowbirds to make new costly decisions to further improve the golf courses. Be prepared for other special assessments as the insurance has to be renewed this summer and rates will go up again due to the hurricanes last season. The buildings in the Glades are in no way secure and safe for hurricanes,
April 17, 05
The board of directors wants to re-introduce charges for golf course use. As the financial situation has for ever been at the near zero mark in the Glades, they have to find new ways of getting more cash flow.
January 13, 2005
Purchase Of Defunct Next Door Ironside Golf Course
Rumors today are flying that some members of the board would like to purchase the bankrupt Ironside Golf Course next door. Reason: The Glades own courses have become over crowded since the golf fees have been incorporated into the maintenance fees. Prior to that only about 30% of Glades members played golf. Now that there is no extra charge and everybody pays, also everybody wants to play.
Some members of the board are playing with the idea of purchasing above mentioned course, but we all know the Glades does not have the funds.
SUBJECT: A look at the present financial position
Now that the golf course renovation is in full swing and some parts have already been re-done twice it seems to be certain that the association is in some kind of trouble.
The last time the Glades had the golf courses re-done they had a cost overrun of over $ 500,000. Financial responsibility has never been the strongest point of any Glades board over the last many years.
With an expected heavy cost overrun on the golf course renovation, which was NOT approved by the owners as it was introduced as repairs, and the purchase of the old water works which will need repairs and redesign, the monetary situation must have become critical.
For a condominium board there is always an easy way out, make another assessment.
Year end comments are being prepared
The board of directors is playing with the idea to purchase the now defunct water works on Teryl Road for price around $ 300,000. (corrected to 232,000)
possibibility of having to purchase a parcel of land situated on the golf course and still belonging to the original developer in the near future.
$ 1,250,000 for repairs and reconstruction of the 2 golf courses done in summer 2003. (See approved assessments below) Project was completed in fall but there is still the assessment of $ 500.00 payable in May 2004 towards this project.
Possibility of very large hike in Association Insurance Premium. This should reflect in a sizable increase in the per condo unit maintenance fees or special assessments in the budget for 2004 and 2005.
The board of directors has borrowed 1 million Dollars over the last 2 years to cover the increased cost of insurance. Most of the owners are not aware of that fact and will have to be assessed to pay for that debt. The approximate amount to cover a million dollars would be around $ 500.00 per condo unit. Also the increase of 1/2 million dollars per year justifies an increase in maintenance fees of $ 41.67 per month in the very near future..
(the State of Florida has lifted the cap for insurance companies as of January 1, 2003 and the insurance companies have started to charge mainly older condominium associations fees up to 10 times the value charged in 2002, according to a "Naples News" report in February 03)
Glades Short of money, begging for it
ASSOCIATION LETTER SENT TO ALL GLADES CONDO OWNERS asking them in case of death to leave their estate or part of it to the Glades Country Club. This subject is also addressed on the Glades own TV channel........................(This no joke but an actual fact)
Real Estate Companies and the Glades CC or Riviera Golf Estates
These companies agents will not steer potential buyers to these areas of lower priced condominiums or homes unless specifically asked for. Agents who work on commissions on the sales they make, naturally will try to sell higher priced real estate and therefore have a very negative approach towards the areas covered on this site because of the lower prices.
There are a few exceptions . Some real estate agents are owners in the Glades and some others in Riviera Estates, are very active within these communities.
NEWS + RUMORS FROM THE GLADES CC
Maybe this season the Glades grounds may see flowers again
The piece of land on the small golf course that still belongs to the original developer is expected to soon become a legal matter before the courts.
The Glades also has again changed condominium lawyer,
2005 - 2006 (Sunrise 4) a satellite, condos sell for more.
It has been noted in the recorded sales in the Naples News on line, that condo's in Sunrise 4 a satellite unit of the Glades where maintenance fees are considerably (about 30% ) less than in the Glades itself, condos have been sold for $ 140,000. Owners of Sunrise 4, enjoy the same privileges than Glades owners for less maintenance fees.
Resale values in the Glades have decreased over the last 2 years
Comparing resale price in various communities in East Naples
Compared with the Winterpark development , adjoining the Glades right next door towards Davis Boulevard, prices in the Glades are slightly lower.
The Winterpark condominiums have no balconies and no golf courses and no green space, but prices on recent transaction have been sold at an average of $ 125,000.00 to $ 139,000.00
Riviera Gold Estates with a public golf course (no upkeep by association) has seen a dramatic increase in values of between $ 30,000 to $ 50,000 since January 2004, due mainly to raising property prices in east Naples.
Sunrise situated within the Glades Country (along Palm Drive) but not part of the Glades has seen a drastic increase in property values in 2004.
View toward club house along Harrison road
The legal name of the Glades Country Club is the
Glades CC Apartments Association Inc.
Administrative Setup of the Glades CC Apartments Association Inc.
Board of Directors
Division and Setup of the Glades CC Apartments Association Inc.
Unlike most condominium associations this one is subdivided into 12 different sections as they were setup by the developer. The smallest section has about 9 units and the largest has somewhere around 200 units, Each section has 1 director of which many have been elected by self nomination and acclamation, because nobody else wanted the job. Each director has the same voting right even if he or she represents only a small section. Therefore the few directors of the smaller sections have a balance of power on the board of directors without representing a majority of the owners of the whole association.
"One of the
penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that you end up being
governed by your inferiors."
Discrimination and Preferential treatment by Board Members for Members of the Board
The director of one of the sections along Palm Drive has just finished building a addition to the building he lives in. The addition looks like a permanent structure with stucco walls and glass windows. Permits where issued by the Glades CC for a patio enclosure without any specifications which is totally against the rules and by-laws.
Construction started around November 17/03 . The contractor completely removed the original enclosure and poured a new cement foundation and constructed frame walls with a stucco outside finish, which makes it look like an addition to the building which it seems to be.
Any major change in this particular section needs the approval of 100% of the owners. Without this approval such an undertaking is not allowed and illegal according to the Glades documents and by-laws.
At Board Meeting December 11, 2003:
The rest of the board seems to be protecting the move by this member. A year ago the board had a balcony enclosure dismantled in section 11, because it did not conform to the rules and yet the board fully protects this member in his illegal behavior of snubbing association rules and building codes.
2nd E-Mail of December 29, 2003
unday, October 19, 2003
By TAMELA EADY WISEMAN, Special to the Daily News
Most Florida elected officials are subject to government in the sunshine laws which prohibit members of the same governing body from discussing among themselves issues related to their offices other than at a meeting, noticed and open to the public. Similar, albeit not as stringent, requirements apply to directors of Florida condominium, cooperative and homeowners' associations ("community associations").
Read the whole article by clicking on the link ► http://www.naplesnews.com/03/10/realestate/d965082a.htm
This article is featured in the Naples News Real Estate section (Nov 2/03)
Read the whole article by clicking on the link ►
Satellite Associations within the Glades CC Territory
There are 3 satellites sections within the Glades Country Club with a total of approximately 87 condo units. The owners of these condos have full right to all of the Glades recreational activities. They do pay an assessment towards these activities. All other expenses as land care and building upkeep is run by their own associations which in turn are managed by outside management companies, contrary to the Glades Country Club. Therefore the monthly maintenance fees for the owners is these satellite associations is a little more than the 50% of what the Glades owners are paying. They enjoy the same rights and privileges as the Glades owners for less monetary participation.
Maintenance fees in Sunrise 2 $ 920.00 every 3 month (with same privileges as Glades Owners)
Administrative Setup of the Glades CC Apartments Association Inc.
Unlike most condominium associations this one is physically run by the board of directors with the assistance of a state licensed CAM (Condominium Association Manager).
The new Glades CAM is John Cassio and comes from WCI Communities. He was featured in the Managers' Report Magazine as the manager of the month in Apr 2002 and has experience with golf course communities that feature a restaurant and bar. He also is experienced in negotiating service and insurance contracts.
In most Florida condominium associations, administrative tasks are performed by professional management firms which have all the contacts for better purchasing and organization than an amateur board of directors.
Therefore the cost of administration in this particular case is an estimated $ 400,000.00 higher than it could be if it would be run by a professional management company.
Bidding for contracts in maintenance, construction or purchases in the Glades CC Apartments Association Inc.
Multiple bidding for contracts in the Glades country club is NOT a standard policy for all the years the Glades Country Club existed. Florida condominium law specifies that any contract over $ 100,000.00 has to have at least 3 bids. It has always been a question mark how and why the board of directors approves mostly single bid contracts by mostly unanimous vote.
Political Setup of the Glades CC Apartments Association Inc.
Ir is assumed that the political power within this association are the golfing (approximately 1/3rd out of a total of 1169 owners) year round residents by controlling the board with mostly elected by acclamation directors. These golfing members, which are tightly organized , run the association with a probable majority of 90% on the board of directors.
Legal behavior of the Glades CC Apartments Association Inc.
This condominium association has received several warnings by the State of Florida for incorrect behavior and disregard of Florida Condominium Laws over the last few years. The State has requested education for the board members or face enforcement.
These warning-documents by the State of Florida are public record and can be viewed on demand, according to law at the association offices.
In April 2003 the board decided to re-design and renovate the 2 golf courses to the tune of over $ 1, 000,000.00. An architect has been hired to draw the plans. In order not have to put this re-design and renovation job for a vote to the members as required by law, the board has been calling it maintenance and or repairs.
Division of Florida Land Sales, Condominiums, and Mobile Homes, will hold FREE courses for condominium and cooperative unit owners in Florida over the course of the year 2003.
Find out more on Condominium owners and Board of directors education by the State of Florida
Florida Condominium and Cooperative Education
Monetary behavior of the Glades CC Apartments Association Inc.
Apparently, in 2002, the association had to borrow $ 500,000.00 at 4.5% interest from a bank to pay for the general insurance for the 2003 coverage. As the State has removed the cap of insurance premiums and the coverage coming up for 2003 could be many times previously amounts charged.
The state mandated reserves seem to have been depleted because the board seems to be continuously using reserve money (inter mingling) to other items or improve the golf course, instead for the purpose it is meant for, mainly the buildings.
The deficit in the restaurant has risen from $ 50,000 six years ago to over $ 150,000.00. while the board of directors only mentions GROSS PROFIT and forgets the cost part during board meetings.
Disposal of assets by the Association
The association purchases , usually without any bidding, an estimated average of $ 150,000.00 worth of golf course equipment per year. (inventory on the books is around 1 million dollars) This equipment is used and written off, over a period of 3 years and then disposed off, at sometimes less than 10% the purchase price even if the going market value is still around 50% of the original purchase price.
Any investigative action into this matter by some past members of the board have been quashed by the officers or the majority of the board members.
Verification of finished work by maintenance and building contractors.
As all Glades Country Club building and maintenance work is directly run by the board members through the intermediary of the CAM there has never been a set policy to check work done. For example the board authorizes a painting contractor to re-paint a section (40 buildings) of the association property with a first class quality paint. There has never been a proper control and assurance to verify that the contractor is actually using the specified quality of material.
Dogs: 1 Dog or cat allowed per unit. A dog shall not weigh more than 15 lbs.
Rentals: 1 month minimum. Renter has to be screened by a committee and has to pay the maximum by law allowable fee for this service. Renter are not allowed to bring animals. Renters can not play golf in the morning, afternoons only.
BUDGET INCREASE FOR 2004
Some owners have already received notification for an over 20% increase in their monthly maintenance fees for 2004 which are probably the highest in all of Florida and could push the cost for some units over $ 500.00 per month in some sections of the association. Owners had the right to reject the budget when it comes to a vote in November 2003 but ...............................
Owners complained that they had no chance to vote because the board of directors did the voting, not realizing that they handed the proxies to the directors that instructed and pewrmitted them to vote.
Condominium owners can withhold the proxies so that the board does NOT achieve a quorum of necessary voters and therefore can not vote and the project is defeated.
Comments to coming up vote by proxy for approval of budget for 2005 in November 2004
By RICHARD WHITE, Special to the Daily News
September 26, 2004
Q. Do I correctly understand your article that states reserves for roofing, paving and painting are required for all condos? We are in a condominium with 350 units and have never had reserves in the 25 plus years that we have been full-time residents. We have always paid for such things as painting, roofs and paving by special assessments as needed. Each year all residents are asked to vote as to whether they wish full reserves, partial reserves or no reserves. Each year the vast majority of us vote for no reserves. Are we in violation of Florida law in doing so? L.L. — Naples
A. You ask two questions and the answer for both is no. From your information provided, it appears that your association is properly complying with the statutes in that each year the board prepares an adequate reserve budget and the members vote it out. While the statutes require all condominiums have a budget with adequate reserves, the statutes also allow the members to vote out or reduce the reserves. Both the state and I believe this action of voting out reserves is wrong, the statutes allow the elimination of reserves each year by a member's vote. My reasons for suggesting that the association have reserves are that first it does not cost any more to pay the reserves on time in small payments. Many owners have problems paying a large amount in a special assessment when the special assessment is due. Buyers are becoming more aware of the value of associations with reserves and pay more for units with proper reserves.
(This site still has to state that the present by-laws do not seem to be fully legal as at the last amendment on March 15, 1990 it does not appear that record title holders, the owners, and mortgage title holders have approved the amendments) (For a change of the documents and by-laws 100% of the owners and mortgage holders have to give their agreement, which is a just impossible feat).
As it looks the Glades CC Association or, and their attorney's, did either not have the votes to make the changes in the documents or neglected to register them, which actually makes the last change illegal and not valid in principle.
As per the Clerk Of Courts of Collier County::
There seems to be a long term lease with the Hubschmans (original developer) signed on June 21, 1971 (mentioning Glades 1 and there must be similar ones for the other sections) which do not seem to be cancelled in the Glades and County records and could still be valid. In all past financial statements of The Glades Country Club over the years, there is no mentioning of the monthly amounts of $ 2000.00 or $ 24,000 per year being paid and due to the Hubschmans until December 31, 2071.
Copy of lease:
Knowing the facts about a Condominium Association can help to make up the mind of interested parties that intend to purchase a condominium in a particular association.
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INC. was founded to unite Floridians in their quest to improve the daily
lives of CITIZENS in our State. We are seeking to present CITIZENS'
interest in Florida through ADVOCACY, EDUCATION and LEGISLATIVE REFORM. Our
founding forefathers said:
"From Justice as a Foundation all Rights flow!"
"Working to safeguard the rights of homeowners living in deed restricted communities"
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